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Part II: The Green Meme and Lines of Development

Posted on Feb 25th, 2006 by Vanessa : Dharma Dancer Vanessa

Okay, again, I still have two papers to write but I had another idea I wanted to explore briefly in continuation of the conversation below on Salvaging the Green Meme.

Matthew made an important point in his comment about the desire to bypass the green cleanse being more of an orange desire, for yellow is inherently inclusive of all the first six tier systems, but here's my question...

What happens when we start looking at lines of development? Reading through Wilber's new book Integral Spirituality, I've become really interested in the complexity that lines add to our discussion on development. When we talk in SDi language it is true that no stage can be skipped in the unfolding, but when we add lines to the equation we suddenly get different lines developing relatively independently through each stage. Although always interacting, the key is that they all develop from precon to con to postcon relatively separately.  And when we look at development this way it becomes...well frankly, really messy(-:

I don't know how many people I've met who so obviously carry yellow if not turquoise to coral cognition yet are emotionally, psychosexually, or relationally still extremely underdeveloped (we all know this problem both in ourselves and others in our life).  I think a healthy relational and emotional line evolves out of a strong green base and without which yellow and turquoise cognition can still be developed but very asymmetrically and perhaps sometimes without the heart.  Now maybe this is an unfair assessment, I'm open to criticism (isn't that green of me(-:), but I would argue that I've seen this problem enough to be relatively concerned by it.

The other thing I was thinking today was that Beck and Wilber often say that an emergence into a new system, in this case yellow, is accompanied by a rejection of the previous level, and that this is an important part of its detachment process.  So it's definitely essential that we keep this in mind but also watch that it doesn't become dissociation.  

The last thought I wanted to throw out there and which is open to feedback is something I've been wondering about for a while.  We often talk about the pathology of green being its affair with an unhealthy narcissistic red that we never truly healed and transcended and so sits at the base of a lot of green motivations.  So here's my concern... As we now try to move ourselves up to second tier, what happens to that red if we still haven't done our good HEALTHY green emotional work that would allow us to re-identify with that red and then transcend it?

 Pathologies don't just disappear because we get to integral; in fact shadows grow the farther up we go without dealing with those pathologies. So my question is, if we haven't healed that red that was sitting at the core of our unhealthy green is it possible that that red viciousness can then transmute to become that which vehemently rejects all things green and attaches itself to the new discourse of power (integral) for the purpose of its own survival? Discourse is power (yes I'm a fan of Foucault(-:) and I just worry that discourses can be learned and used even when we don't necessarily completely embody integral in a majority of our other lines.    

Just some thoughts...still to be continued...   

Access_public Access: Public 8 Comments Print views (341)  
Rob : One
4 days later
Rob said

All of this sounds very insightful/intelligent…but I must admit, I have no idea what any of it means…is there anywhere I can find a basic outline of what these colour memes represent?

-Rob

Vanessa : Dharma Dancer
5 days later
Vanessa said

Thanks so much for checking in about that Rob! Sorry for the sometimes exclusionary discourse(-:  If you look up Spiral Dynamics on the internet you should be able to find lots of info. There are some books, the best one I would recommend is Boomeritis: A Novel that will set you Free by Ken Wilber, it gives the best easy read of the colors based within the context of an interesting novel.  Definately worth checking out! 

Rob : One
5 days later
Rob said

cool, thanks!

-Rob

Vanessa : Dharma Dancer
5 days later
Vanessa said

No problemo,
Oh and don’t hesitate to email me with any questions for clarification if you want.  I’ll do my best to help out!

sass : integral feminist philosopher
11 days later
sass said

Hi Vanessa,
I love your analysis here .. and I think you are right onto something.
I have wondered whether a second tier pathology isn’t a sort of holier than thou attitude - which is part of the dismissal of green. But then i think the (healthy) principles of yellow are to honour the other tiers..
but, yes, then you get all of those other lines.. at their own stages at play  (there’s the mess!)

about 1 month later
Joshua said

I can tell you from personal experience what happens to people who maintain green sensibilities with a unhealthy red underbelly….their lives become self-righteously identified with their perceptions.  They are wonderful at providing examples of why something is wrong, but the emotional tone of their views comes from the wounded redness to be right at all costs.  If you ever get into a debate with someone like this the best method to use is the Socratic, because they are so readily upset that once challenged, they lose their cool and cannot argue logically all of the points they are bringing up, so you can very easily lead them back into contradiction.  What I have found to be worse than this is when someone's cognition is 2nd tier while they continue to suffer from red power issues.  I had a martial arts instructor who is also gifted with some siddhis, and I can attest that he isn't afraid to use his spiritual prowess from a red motivation.  I have heard of similar comments made regarding some of Andrew Cohen's methods…and while I don't deny that some people need to be challenged in this way, all spiritual teachers should disclaim from the beginning their methods and it should be agreed upon by the teacher and seeker, otherwise it's too easy for a teacher to manipulate the student.  I was fortunate that I was able to see him interact with others outside our normal channels, otherwise I might still consider myself a student of his.  It's a prime example of what you were saying Vanessa, and that we definitely need to use green's strengths to help shore up our weaknesses.

Vanessa : Dharma Dancer
about 1 month later
Vanessa said

Good examples Joshua. I too have come across many spiritual teachers and second tier leaders who will remain nameless(-: who also carry this characteristic. Of course I've seen it manifest in many different lines for different individuals, some its their emotional capacity, some thier psychosexual development and others thier relational sensibilities. It still amazes me though… still devastates me at some level also. I of course am far from perfect and know the limits of my own capacities (of course I can't be aware of all of them), but I feel that I am always working to be conscious of them, to move throught them etc. I'm not asking anyone to be perfectly developed in all thier lines, God I know how unrealistic that is but its when I see men and women in thier 40's, 50's, and 60's who are still unwilling to admit thier own limitations that I get so disappointed, especially when they are important leaders in the world, but then again perhaps that is what makes it harder. 

I know myself how hard it is to see my own shadow, but thats why I have people in my life who can point it out for me and hopefully with compassion(-; Its the self-righteousness that I sometimes see that is so painful, so hurtful to others and that I truly detest because these people are not ignorant or stupid. Anyways I don't know where I”m going with this, thanks for your insights.

Bryan : Maybe Meme
over 2 years later
Bryan said

I've lacked this kind of dialogue for a while and I can't stop reading even though I know my circadian rhythm has now gone wacko at almost 3 am here.

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